"Wanted Dread or Alive" Bullets and Blood Part 2

In further unraveling the mythos surrounding Bob Marley's death, Host Henry K critically analyzes the proliferation of conspiracy theories, particularly the infamous 'poison boot' narrative that posits nefarious intent behind his rare form of melanoma. Through expert testimonies and thorough investigation, the episode dismantles these urban legends, emphasizing the importance of distinguishing fact from fiction. The discussion unveils the complexities of Marley's health struggles, drawing attention to the scientific underpinnings of melanoma and the multifaceted factors contributing to its progression. The speakers advocate for a nuanced understanding of Marley's demise, urging listeners to confront the uncomfortable truths about mortality and the often invisible forces at play in the lives of those who dare to challenge the status quo. Ultimately, Henry K joined by Malrey Biographer Roger Steffens not only seek to clarify Marley's story but also create a broader commentary on the nature of truth and the societal impulses that seek to obscure it.
Produced by Henry K in association with Voice Boxx Studios Kingston, Jamaica
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The CIA does not care about human life.
Speaker AIt doesn't care about peace at all.
Speaker AIt cares about winning and perpetuating and expanding itself.
Speaker AAnd that's not an exaggeration.
Speaker AThey have an entire procedure they've developed over the last 40 years since Gary Webb.
Speaker AHe destroyed his career, lost his marriage, his finances, and then wound up in a hotel room with two bullets in his head because he reported on CIA drug running and he wrote the book Dark Alliance.
Speaker ATheir most favorite form of assassination is pushing someone to suicide.
Speaker AAnd then that gives them the doctrine of plausible deniab.
Speaker AAnd that comes from national security council directive 102 in 1948, where the CIA can do anything it wants.
Speaker ASabotage, subversion, economic warfare, assassination can do anything it wants.
Speaker AAs long as there's plausible denial for the US Government.
Speaker AIt can deny any involvement.
Speaker AThe CIA can do anything it wants.
Speaker ANow imagine that with their 39 billion plus budget and the power of secrecy they have, the things that they have done and are doing are unconscionable.
Speaker BEntertainer and reggae star Bob Marley, Rita Marley and the manager of the Whalers, Don Taylor, are now patients in the University Hospital after his receiving gunshot wounds during a shooting incident which took place at Marley's home at 56 Hope Road tonight.
Speaker CHow long shall they kill our prophets While we stand aside and look?
Speaker BThe passing of another Jamaican superstar.
Speaker DReggae dynamo Peter Tott, one of the original winners, had passed away by the gun.
Speaker CBy the gun.
Speaker CGlory to John.
Speaker CLet him be.
Speaker CPraise his righteousness.
Speaker EGovern the world.
Speaker CThere's a frequency that most people never hear, a vibration beyond human perception where power distills its most intimate violence.
Speaker CBob Marley understood this frequency.
Speaker CAnd that the most dangerous weapons are those you cannot see.
Speaker CYes, Robert Nestor, Molly, that little yellow boy from 9 miles Jamaica, teased for his mixed heritage, who transformed his personal pain into a global symphony of resilience.
Speaker CHis life wasn't just a musical journey.
Speaker CIt was a living conspiracy theory, a story that challenged every system designed to silence him.
Speaker CImagine someone born in a rural village with no electricity, fathered by a man rarely seen and raised in the Kingston slums, becomes a global icon.
Speaker CIsn't that itself a kind of miracle that defies conventional storytelling?
Speaker CA conspiracy theory is never about this story.
Speaker CIt's about the wounded heart asking who is truly in control.
Speaker CAnd for marginalized communities who've experienced historic oppression, these urban legends become a form of resistance, a way of turning helplessness into narrative power.
Speaker CWhen Bob Marley succumbed to a rare form of melanoma in 1981, the vague explanations that followed his death Combined with previous attempts on his life created the perfect environment for rumors and innuendos to pollinate.
Speaker CHis body became a battlefield.
Speaker CHis cancer spread with the velocity that medical professionals found extraordinary.
Speaker CA Sloan Kettering doctor noted there was more cancer in Marley than he had seen in any living human being.
Speaker CThe stories that persisted about a CIA plot surrounding Marley's death weren't just speculations.
Speaker CThese were desperate attempts to understand power, the very forces that shape human destinies.
Speaker CThe most pervasive urban legend, as we'll learn, involved a poison boot given to Bob that delivered a deadly toxin to the very same toe where his cancer was first diagnosed.
Speaker CAnd the mysterious documentarian with connections to intelligence agencies that gave him the gift.
Speaker CBob Marley's voice grew even louder after his death, while simultaneously being commodified.
Speaker CThe Marley estate generates tens of millions of dollars a year on everything from coffee mugs to cannabis products, a transformation that would bemuse, if not trouble.
Speaker CThe man whose famous last words were money can't buy life.
Speaker CBut as we've learned, money can buy death.
Speaker CWhich is why so many people continue to ask if his illness was engineered.
Speaker CThey say that truth is stranger than fiction.
Speaker CYet in a world of misinformation, where the official narrative crumbles under the weight of coincidence, it becomes impossible to tell one from the other.
Speaker CBut at least let's start with the truth.
Speaker CAn article dated September 1975 from Time magazine, just a year prior to the attempt on Marley's life on Hope Road and the alleged poison boot incident that occurred days later as Marley hid out at Chris Blackwell's Mount Richery outside Kingston.
Speaker CThe article is titled CIA Toxin T O X I n Toxin T O C S I n the boot with its tiny steel tongue flashed out.
Speaker CBond felt a sharp pain in his right calf.
Speaker CNumbness was creeping up Bond's body.
Speaker CThere was no feelings in his fingers.
Speaker CBreathing became difficult.
Speaker CBond pivoted slowly on his heel and crashed headlong onto the wine red floor.
Speaker CSo ends Ian Fleming's delightful spy novel from Rusher With Love.
Speaker CWith James Bond's fate Left hanging, Agent 007, of course, survives to brave new dangers in Dr.
Speaker CNo, in which it is revealed that he has been dealt a near fatal dose of fugu poison.
Speaker CIt comes from the sex organs of a Japanese globefish.
Speaker CAn eminent neurologist tells Bond's boss, it's terrible stuff and very quick.
Speaker CLast week, Fleming's words sprang eerily into the real world.
Speaker CIdaho Democrat Frank Church, chairman of the special Senate committee investigating the CIA and other intelligence agencies, revealed that the US's James Bonds have their own secret supply of quick and terrible poisons.
Speaker CIn direct violation of a Presidential order, in keeping with the draft convention of the UN Disarmament Conference, Richard Nixon five years ago ordered the destruction of toxins made with cobra venom.
Speaker CThat miniscule stockpile is enough, said Church, to kill many thousands of people.
Speaker CDart guns, six tenths of a milligram of saxitoxin can kill an adult, often within an hour, by blocking transmission of impulses in the nervous system.
Speaker ASystem.
Speaker CJust as in Fleming's account, in the 1950s the CIA began experimenting with saxitoxin at Fort Detrick, Maryland, where it also carried out the notorious LSD experiments that led to, among other things, the long hushed up death of biochemist Frank Olson.
Speaker CThe Agency reportedly developed dart guns and other clever means of delivering the poison.
Speaker CTwo months ago, CIA Director William Colby told the White House he had learned that someone had hidden away, presumably for future use, small amounts of the cobra and shellfish toxins at an Agency lab in downtown Washington.
Speaker CThe White House informed the Church Committee, which this week will hold public hearings on the matter.
Speaker CChurch hopes to discover whether the toxins were ever used in CIA assassination plots.
Speaker CHe is even more concerned with the fact that the Agency violated Nixon's command.
Speaker CThe episode, he said, points up a looseness of command and control within the CIA.
Speaker CAccording to a source close to Church's panel, some low ranking CIA official unknown to the Agency's chiefs had made the decision to retain small quantities of the toxin.
Speaker CCongress has requested that the CIA hold onto all evidence that could be useful to the Church Committee investigation.
Speaker CParts of this story arrive like encrypted messages, their true meaning hidden between the lines of official records.
Speaker CYes, that's the same CIA Director William Colby that was named in the Reuters news report as heading Dr.
Speaker CKissinger's covert operation to destabilize Jamaica.
Speaker CAnd while he was testifying before the Church Committee about deadly toxins illegally stored by the CIA, that of course himself and the upper heads at the Agency were conveniently left in the dark about.
Speaker CHe was simultaneously waging war on the good people of Jamaica, attempting to overthrow the island's elected government.
Speaker CYes, and that is the same William Colby that channeled money and weapons to CIA backed militias that attempted to kill Bob Marley just Prior to his December 1976 Smile Jamaica concert and then the Prime Minister the following week.
Speaker CYou see, that Smile Jamaica concert was more than a music event.
Speaker CIt was a moment of potential reconciliation in a country torn apart by tribal warfare.
Speaker CMarley had agreed to perform despite the attempt on his life, in order to cool down the volcanic tensions between the two rival political factions, Chris Blackwell, founder of Marley's record label, Island Records, never one to let a good marketing opportunity pass by, hired a film crew from the United States to fly down and record the event, hoping to forever preserve the historic performance.
Speaker CAmong the production team that arrived in Jamaica was a talented young cameraman who'd later become an award winning filmmaker named Carl Colby.
Speaker CAn interesting piece of trivia.
Speaker CHe was the 25 year old son of the acting director of the Central Intelligence Agency, William Colby.
Speaker CAnd while his father was funding a turf war wreaking havoc on the streets of Kingston that had bodies piling up faster than they could be buried, his son Carl Colby, by all accounts was granted unprecedented access to Marley not just as a filmmaker, but as a documentarian, capturing every moment of vulnerability.
Speaker CAfter the assassination attempt left Marley wounded, Colby followed Marley up to Chris Blackwell's Strawberry Hill retreat, a mound sanctuary that was more than just a safe house.
Speaker CMysteriously, all those reels of footage prior to the show disappeared without a trace.
Speaker CAnd the only film that survived was that of the concert itself.
Speaker CAnd let's discuss music mogul Chris Blackwell for a minute, whose reputation is divided between two camps.
Speaker CThose who see him as the genius that introduced Bob Marley's untapped talent to the world, and those who see him as the man who broke up the original Wailers in order to commercially exploit Bob's untapped talent for himself.
Speaker CEither way, Blackwell was no ordinary producer.
Speaker CHis roots ran deep into Jamaican colonial history.
Speaker CA descendant of one of the island's most powerful white families, he was a man who understood the delicate choreography of cultural export and political influence.
Speaker CThe connections were intricate.
Speaker CBlackwell began his career working on the set of the James Bond film Dr.
Speaker CNo, thanks to the help of close family friend and Bond author Ian Fleming.
Speaker CFleming, a former British military intelligence officer, moved to Jamaica after World War II and wrote the James Bond series from his picturesque home in Port Antonio Goldeneye, named after one of his secret missions in the war.
Speaker CIn one of his spy thrillers, From Russia to Love, Bond is almost killed by a toxin so precisely it mimics natural disease, life imitating art, or art revealing hidden mechanisms of power, we see how conspiracy begins to take shape.
Speaker CLike a melody, this song begins with an innocuous gift, unremarkable in every way except for the one who delivered it.
Speaker CCarl Colby, son of CIA director William Colby, a man with access to corridors that most never glimpse.
Speaker CCarl Colby, whose father, CIA, had just been caught red Handed, holding onto the biological toxins saxitoxin and cobra venom, microscopic weapons capable of silencing a human body with less than a milligram.
Speaker CThe widely believed and popular poison boot theory centers around the young Carl Colby and a brand new pair of soccer cleats, or boots, as they're called in Jamaica, he gifted to Bob in the days following the shooting at Hope Road, while Marley was seeking refuge at Strawberry Hill.
Speaker CAnd let me first unequivocally state, there is absolutely no evidence at all other than sketchy second and third hand accounts from supposed witnesses on the scene who say Marley grimaced in pain and said ow.
Speaker CAfter trying on one of those new shoes given to him by Colby, only to reveal that his big toe had been punctured by a thin copper wire hidden within the boot.
Speaker CBob, thinking nothing of it at the time, moved on.
Speaker CBut this was in fact, a poison boot, the copper wire laced with a toxin that had transferred the deadly melanoma cells into his body.
Speaker CAnd at that point, it was just a matter of time.
Speaker CSure enough, within five years, Bob Marley, a physically fit 36 year old picture of health, would be dead, his unrecognizable body ravaged by the rare cancer.
Speaker CThe attack on Marley at his home in 1976 was the obvious violence.
Speaker CIt turns out the more sophisticated elimination would later come disguised as illness.
Speaker CIt's a fantastic story, almost as good as the first time it appeared in the Ian Fleming novel From Russia with Love in 1957.
Speaker CBut like so much misinformation disseminated in both the Marley and Tosh cases, these distractions are designed to keep us from exploring more productive avenues of truth.
Speaker CAnd I know there are conspiracy enthusiasts who are all in on the poison boot theory, but this show is about a quest for truth.
Speaker CAnd when you methodically strip away the impossible, the implausible and the convenient, what you're left with is not just the truth, but a skeleton of reality itself.
Speaker CHow did Bob Marley actually die?
Speaker CTo really examine the bones of these urban legends under a microscope, I'm calling on two trusted voices, experts in their perspective fields, to help shine a light on what is fact and hopefully close the book on what is fiction.
Speaker CFirst, excerpts of my conversation with Roger Steffen, author, Marley biographer, music historian, who was quite adamant and definitive that even though Carl Colby was indeed the cameraman for the Smile Jamaica concert and the son of William Colby, the CIA director at the time, there was nothing nefarious or underhanded about his presence in Jamaica.
Speaker CHe was merely a talented cameraman that was part of the crew hired to film the event.
Speaker CIt was only decades later, after Roger Steffens contacted him, that Colby even found out that he was at the center of a conspiracy theory surrounding Bob Marley's death.
Speaker COh, by the way, another interesting piece of trivia.
Speaker CCarl Colby was next door neighbor to O.J.
Speaker Csimpson's ex wife, Nicole, and he testified in Simpson's murder trial that he once observed O.J.
Speaker Clurking outside Nicole's house and called 911.
Speaker CSo, Roger, now circling back to Marley, I just want to clear up and debunk some myths that are out there, you know, especially when it comes to Carl Colby, the poison boot.
Speaker CYou're the one who actually tracked down Carl Colby, right?
Speaker CCorrect.
Speaker DThey knew nothing about it.
Speaker COh, he didn't.
Speaker DI think they were on their way from the airport when they heard the bulletin on the radio that Bob had been shot.
Speaker DYou know, and then Marlon James book did nothing to help the situation because so many people, just as I feared, take that as a Romana clef, a fictionalized version of true events.
Speaker DAnd I think he places the Carl Colby figure weeks in advance, going down and putting the posse together to come and kill Bob, which is utter nonsense and fiction.
Speaker CNow, Roger, you were friends with Marley, close with everyone in his inner circle.
Speaker CDid anyone ever see Bob try on a boot, a cleat, get poked with any needles, injections, anything like that?
Speaker DYou know, Neville Garrick told me it never happened.
Speaker DSkill Cole, his best friend, said it never happened.
Speaker DPlus, even, even if it were, you can't give someone cancer.
Speaker DYou can't inject someone with melanoma.
Speaker DIt's medically impossible.
Speaker DSo, you know, forget about that.
Speaker DThere was no poison boot.
Speaker DEver.
Speaker CRoger Stephan stands as a custodian of Bob Marley's legacy.
Speaker CNot just preserving the icon, but dismantling the urban myths and rumors that have calcified around his death.
Speaker CWith the precision of a scholarly detective, Steffens has spent years cutting through the sensationalism, fighting dangerous mythologies that rob a human being of their authentic story.
Speaker CWe'll circle back to Roger shortly to discuss another deeply disturbing conspiracy, this time revolving around Marley's cancer treatment in Switzerland during his final months of life under the care of the notorious Dr.
Speaker CJoseph Issals, the so called Nazi doctor.
Speaker CBut for now, our journey turns from the archives of memory to the precise landscape of medical understanding.
Speaker CDr.
Speaker CD, as we'll call him, longtime friend and maestro of melanoma, emerges, ready to decode the biological narrative of Marley's ultimate vulnerability.
Speaker CThis is not about perpetuating myths, but about understanding the Brutal, unforgiving biology of melanoma.
Speaker CA disease that doesn't discriminate, that doesn't bow to political pressure or revolutionary spirits.
Speaker CYou see, every cell in our body tells a story more complex than any conspiracy could imagine.
Speaker CHey, Dr.
Speaker CD.
Speaker CThank you so much for doing this.
Speaker CThank you.
Speaker EHey, Henry K.
Speaker EHow can I help you out?
Speaker ELet me know how you want to get started.
Speaker CWell, yeah, let's start out at the beginning.
Speaker CWhat kind of cancer did Bob Marley have?
Speaker EHe had a rare melanoma.
Speaker CHow rare was it in terms of melanoma?
Speaker EIt was the subungual below nail variant.
Speaker EThis accounts for only up to 3% of all melanomas.
Speaker C3%.
Speaker CSo that's a very small percentage of melanomas that Bob had.
Speaker CThat's extremely rare.
Speaker EYes, I'm afraid it is.
Speaker CSo Dr.
Speaker CRita Marley famously said in an interview that Bob got his cancer from the white side of his family.
Speaker CAnd I've also heard Roger Steffens say that there was a history of cancer on his father's side who was white.
Speaker CSo does race play a part in this type of cancer?
Speaker EThese melanomas can occur in anyone, regardless of race.
Speaker EBut actually his type of melanoma accounts for around 75% of all melanomas in dark skinned people.
Speaker CReally?
Speaker EIf anything, this came from his non white side.
Speaker CSo that's probably fairly recent information because I don't think many people knew that at the time of his death or it certainly wasn't publicized.
Speaker CSo here's the big question.
Speaker CThere's a widely believed urban legend that somehow Bob Marley got the cancer from a poison boot that injected him with a needle that gave him the melanoma somehow.
Speaker CIs this possible?
Speaker CCan someone get melanoma?
Speaker CIs it contagious?
Speaker EIs this cancer transmissible by contact needle or syringe?
Speaker ENo, there's no science in favor of that.
Speaker EThere's no known virus, for instance.
Speaker CSo in your best medical opinion, a maestro of melanoma, someone who does this all the time, how did Bob get such a rare form of cancer?
Speaker EThe cause is unknown.
Speaker ENot so much the sun, but genetic factors that weaken immune surveillance for this type of cancer plus some kind of trauma can contribute cause inflammation.
Speaker CWell, that's also new because back in the day they didn't think that an injury could result in cancer.
Speaker CSo takes a little bit away from the conspiracy.
Speaker EBut in any specific case, Henry, it's really hard to know.
Speaker EFor example, did he have the melanoma and that weakened the skin vessels under this nail so that it bled more easily when he Kicked something?
Speaker EOr did he injure his toe and the resulting inflammatory response somehow triggered the beginning of cancer?
Speaker EWe don't know.
Speaker COkay, fair enough.
Speaker CWhat do we know?
Speaker EHe had an unfortunately rare, often overlooked skin cancer.
Speaker EEven if the toe was amputated, that would not have guaranteed curing it.
Speaker EBut it's highly doubtful that this was given to him intentionally or accidentally from somebody else.
Speaker CCould it be that Bob Marley didn't actually need a poison boot to kill him?
Speaker CThat his cancer spread with such velocity because of a change of lifestyle, change of routine, the exile to London?
Speaker CAll those things.
Speaker EAny of these issues, and in any combination.
Speaker ECan indirectly contribute by weakening one's immune system against diseases like cancer.
Speaker EThe reality is just very sad.
Speaker CYes, it is.
Speaker EA rare talent dies of a very rare disease.
Speaker EAnd there's no conspiracy there.
Speaker CWell, thank you for your honest opinion, and thank you for your time.
Speaker CAnd remember, we'll keep your real name under wraps.
Speaker CBecause we don't want the CIA coming after you.
Speaker CIn the twilight of his life, Bob Marley became more than a patient.
Speaker CHe was a pilgrim seeking salvation in the clinical coldness of Bavaria.
Speaker CIn the hands of Dr.
Speaker CJoseph Issels, a physician whose reputation oscillated between miracle worker and medical pariah.
Speaker CSomeone who practiced experimental treatment during the dark chapters of medical history.
Speaker CFor Marley, this was perhaps his last hope.
Speaker CThe final act of resistance against a disease that was consuming him from within.
Speaker CBut his death soon after the treatment became fertile ground for conspiracy theories.
Speaker CWas this another assassination?
Speaker CThis time dressed in the sterile white of medical intervention?
Speaker CThe timing too perfect, the circumstances too convenient?
Speaker CAnd once again, we turn to Roger Steffens for answers.
Speaker CThe Joseph, the Dr.
Speaker CIssel, the SS doctor.
Speaker CI love how you describe his true story.
Speaker DOkay, Dr.
Speaker DIssel's wife tells the story.
Speaker DIt's in so much things to say.
Speaker DI think the dates are accurate.
Speaker DAround 1933, Dr.
Speaker DIssels became a licensed doctor in Germany.
Speaker DWent to work in a Catholic hospital.
Speaker DOne of the priests there told him if he wanted to make advances in his career, he should immediately join the ss, which he did.
Speaker DAnd five years later, as the Nazis consolidated their powers, they demanded that Dr.
Speaker DIssels no longer treat any Jewish patients.
Speaker DAnd he refused to do that.
Speaker DSo not only did he get kicked out of the Party, but he got taken into the army and sent to the front lines in Russia eventually, where he was captured.
Speaker DAnd he was a prisoner of war for most of the Second World War.
Speaker DAnd so the idea that some, quote, Nazi doctor took care of Bob and made sure that he wouldn't leave there Alive is, again, utter nonsense.
Speaker CBut he never was in any camp, served in camp, it was at the hospitals.
Speaker DOh, he was in jail, it was in prison.
Speaker CAnd not to mention, by the time that Bob got to that stage in Switzerland, I think he was being.
Speaker CHe had been.
Speaker CThis cancer had spread so far, I don't know if, you know, had anything.
Speaker DGiven up by the doctors at Sloan Kettering who told him he had maybe three weeks left to live.
Speaker CThe physical wounds caused by the gunman who stormed Marley's home in December 1976 would heal.
Speaker CBut the emotional assault of being hunted in your home, in your own country, by the very people you trusted.
Speaker CFor Bob Marley, that wound was fatal.
Speaker CCancer, as we now understand all these years after Marley's passing, is not just a genetic lottery.
Speaker CIt's a complex interplay of environment, stress, nutrition, exercise and lived experiences.
Speaker CMarley's forced exile from Jamaica to London, his separation from his roots and everything his heart, mind and body held sacred, created the invisible toxins that perhaps contributed more to his illness than any mythical poisoned boot.
Speaker CIn the end, the most sophisticated assassination is not a bullet or a toxin, but the systematic destruction of a human being's environment, community, family, sense of self.
Speaker CBob Marley and Peter Tosh's stories reveal a profound survival is an act of continual resistance.
Speaker CAnd sometimes the most radical act of love is simply refusing to be silenced.
Speaker CTell me, who measures the toll of a revolutionary spirit interrupted?
Speaker CWho counts the songs unsung, the healing uninitiated?
Speaker CWe'll never know how the world could have benefited with just a few more years of Bob Marley, just a couple of more songs.
Speaker CBut we do know what happened to Jamaica once he was gone.
Speaker CBy 1980, all those years of COVID warfare by the CIA and JLP had finally paid off for them, the country in such dire condition that the people finally elected Edward Siaga as their prime minister.
Speaker CJamaica had a conservative leader to kowtow and pander to his newly elected Republican counterpart in the United States, President Ronald Reagan.
Speaker CSiaga and the JLP would spend the next decade consolidating power from the upper houses of Parliament to the downtown gullies and garrisons, those hardened JLP gunmen and criminal gangs that tormented the Kingston streets until they turned blood red.
Speaker CWell, under the new administration, they were war heroes, promoted to ministers and judges and police officers.
Speaker CThe gangsters were given badges and all the impunity that went with them.
Speaker C1980s Jamaica was a decade of exacting revenge, settling old scores.
Speaker CAnd with Bob Marley out of the way, there was another outspoken whaler still left in Babylon's crosshairs.
Speaker CPeter Tosh.
Speaker EIt.
Speaker CSary K.